out of order

in the sense of: not on. Not done, not permissible. Disgraceful. Disgusting. Shocking. Obscene. Not fit for human society, somewhere between antisocial and sociopathic, and just plain inhuman.

This is very sad news:

And this is not an appropriate response:

By saying something like this, someone casts themself outside the conventions of normal human interaction: beyond the pale. From which: deserving to be cast out. Yes, if I were a moderator, I would not only remove the message (as has been done) so as to limit the offense caused; I would also suspend or terminate (to use MUA’s own words) the account. Adding the legal to the political (breach of social contract) and ethical (gross inhumanity).

What not to do. Even if you were brought up by wolves. Or live in a cave and don’t associate with real live humans. Or under a rock. Or, like other trolls, if you are a rock for those periods when you’re not in troll-action.

Bad, mad, unthinking, opened mouth and didn’t care as to the consequences, negligent, irresponsible: who knows. Tolerance has its limits: the basic Kantian (etc.) ones of not hurting others. That statement is hurtful to Abby, but it also hurts Jet and anyone whose reaction is the normal human one of sympathy. It’s a shocking statement on several levels: from the simple direct human emotional one, through do-as-you-would-be-done-by, to an attack on interpersonal interactions and the fabric of human society.

The famous “freedom” in “free speech” and that’s at the basis of decent, civil, civilised society (human and otherwise): contrary to much erroneous popular opinion, it’s not a positive freedom, a freedom to (do something). That’s a false meaning and provably fallacious. No: it’s a freedom from. Freedom from harm, from hurt, from damage by others. It goes along with “rights” not being a right to something but a right in combination with responsibility: it necessarily entails taking responsibility for one’s actions.

Whence the point and purpose of society (human and otherwise): to defend and protect its members; and for members to stand up for each other. Solidarity. This doesn’t necessarily imply control by another section of society, some authoritative group or person above the rest; it can be done by community (see: ANARCHISM of various sorts, and why anarchism is the hardest—and highest— kind of social organization). Here’s community in action:

and then (to which I will be adding a message, inc. this here present post):

(and bringing green-ness into disrepute–on which, UPDATE here below; see also: the saga continues post, featuring response from bcakes and further back-and-forth)

(and making me, and other MUAers, and frankly any right-thinking human being with an ounce of decency BLAZING FUCKING ANGRY. I mean: how can anyone say something like that? It’s mind-boggling.)



DON’T DO THIS. If it’s not clear why this is a terrible thing to say, go ask a responsible adult to explain it and don’t say anything else online until you’ve understood why this sort of thing is bad. This kind of basic socialization is one of the key criteria for graduation from kindergarten to primary school in some countries…

This is for abbyten:



        • gingerama

          (1) Bcakes has a long past history of being pro-EWG, pro-independent, anti-mainstream; taking an environmentalist stance to extremes. Very pro-EWG. To be fair: well-intentioned, pro-planet, and there’s some good to be said of the EWG too (to be overly-fair). There’s been good too from bcakes in the past too, for example here; but this statement goes too far.

          (2) And anti-mineral oil.

          (3) S/he also has a long past history of causing trouble, or stirring it up, or taking discussions off in a troublesome direction. Picking fights.

          OK, to be charitable: this may just be that she types faster than she thinks, or thinks slower than she types. And maybe thinks less (if, sometimees one wonders, at all?) as well as slower. Got to feel sorry for that sort of condition.

          Combine the 3, remove any human compassion, and you get that statement.

          To see more, have a go at some board searches on makeup alley:
          (1) on the skincare board, for “mineral oil”
          (2) on the green board or bcakes
          (3) bcakes’ posting history is on his/her profile page
          I may well have quite a few in these “favourites”.

          But: ITA. I’m confused too. How can anyone say such a horrible thing about someone who’s ill? It’s amazingly mean; like you, I don’t understand.

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